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Poll
Replay of the Year 2017

TeCa vs la0s
heke & linlin)THEone vs RapiNG & POON3SS
RainyMonday vs heke
Sonik vs ToXiGRiNTA
ZeusPark vs RapiNG



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Reign of Chaos 1.29 - The Wishlist
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GhoST
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PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 9:09    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm also agaisnt totally killing tower creeping. It's the same point again, RoC gamestyle. I think that, even if it's not that hard, you need certain game knowledge to tower creeping successfully.

Removing XP gained wouldn't be a solid solution. Increasing towers resources needed to build them or just nerfing them, those are actual solutions that do not change that much RoC.
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moubachaou
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Joined: Jul 14, 2013
Posts: 49

PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 13:13    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think towers in the game are fine except in some situations : tower creeping in certain maps, human towers in mid/late game against undead. With reducing XP gain you'll still be able to use those to creep, but u'll have to finish the creep with your hero, though that might be too much of a change for a majority of players.
Also, I think nerfing cost / damage / HP is something that would break some mus : HUvORC, UDvsOrc, ... For human towers, my idea was to nerf armor/HP upgrades in someway, so buildings / towers becomes killable by gargoils / fiends more easily.
For orc, I don't think towers are much of an issue except for early tower creepings. I would suggest to increase building duration by 20% or so, so it's easier to scout + denie towers in time.


Quote:
Instead, this creeping "strategy" (lol) would simply happen at a slower pace; it could be compared to your suggested increase to the Archers production time


Yes, the two options are equal (lol). Having less (weaker) archers will slightly impact the creeping capability of NE, but also, it will make them more contestable on some maps (SB Orc-Elf) where elf can have 4 archers when orc is still on a single hero. Nerfing creeps, would affect all races and game steps, and I don't see in what way it will balance the game : it's way harder to predict the state of the game with that change and the implications of early / mid game / late game.


Quote:
Potentially having Shadow Meld at tier 2 as you suggested would be much more of a shock and affect greatly the gameplay of Elf players


No ? This has not much to do with the gameplay.
This capacity is clearly OP and give elf too much of an early advantage : unspotted scouts, too big micro potential. Opponent has to buy an 200 gold item at shops (when there is one, it is always far far far away from the action).


Quote:
There are probably plenty of players who just buy the game for the sake of fun and don't even think about ways to balance it, about the possibility of registering somewhere to write stuffs, or maybe they do think about all these but they are just too lazy to do it or whatever else.
Also, if you think everybody understands perfectly the game mechanics, you live in a dream then.


Yes, they buy (bought) it for the sake of fun and play it for the sake of fun. The point here is to balance the game (as u said), not to rethink the gameplay (what you wish). These people maybe don't understand perfectly the mechanics of the game, that's why slight changes wouldn't be noticeable at there level of gameplay and wouldn't affect the "sake of fun". Meanwhile, they understand if they can creep up to lvl 6 or not, and that would for sure affect their game experience (sake of fun).

Quote:
So, basically blocking the level 6 creeping would ruin it all (ROC spirit = level 6 creeping, rofl), but somehow you are fine with blocking the tower-creeping when this a ROC peculiarity just as much as the former


Yes.
I don't think I need to argue this point.


Last edited by moubachaou on Thu May 18, 2017 15:15; edited 1 time in total
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floatingcrackboi
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PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 13:13    Post subject: Reply with quote

try to fix imbalanced matchups (HUvUD,NEvHU)

give creeping less awards

improve the solo mappool, remove crap maps like legends/frostsabre... add more maps and give a higher amount of vetoes

change the amm/ell ladder system, to improve searchtimes

improve the delay!
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AMour
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Joined: Nov 17, 2013
Posts: 179
Location: France

PostPosted: Fri May 19, 2017 12:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

To admins :

I'd find relevant to organize a sort of poll vote in order to sum up which are the top ideas and the most important things to ask for a change.

Is it possible to make a poll with
50 items including YES or NO for each or something like that?
Im just giving an idea, I'm sure you'll find the best way!

But we should really follow these two steps to make it clear:

1) what to change
2) how (we can nerf an unit using several ways)
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CForever
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Joined: Sep 08, 2013
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PostPosted: Sat May 27, 2017 1:01    Post subject: Reply with quote

Archers are the main problem imho
hh a bit op but orc badly needs them vs air
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Kingstreet
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Joined: Jun 05, 2017
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 21:21    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is great that we get the chance to give some input to the upcoming patch.

My thoughts based on years of experience, both playing and observing:

1 Main
-Creeping is too much rewarding in general. Maybe nerf this a little.
-Update the map pool, remove the imbalanced maps frostsabre and legends. Add new maps, where we have more maps to choose and to veto, since it upgrades the skill needed, the exitement and also improve the strategies that can be applied.
-Towers and espcially towercreeping are imbalanced, possible solutions include: change armor to heavy, lower the hp, or/and let towers who kill creeps don't gain any gold/expe like in TFT.

2 Units
-Air is overpowered, especially gargs, change them to 3 food, or higher the cost.
-Heavy melee can be upgraded, since they are almost never used. I like the armor change suggestion
-+10 gold for an archer
-+20 gold for a dryad
- -1 armor for DH
-10% lower damage on tanks
-increse DH ultimate cooldown time by 20-30 seconds
-Increse the sleep lvl 3 of DL by 20 mana
- +50 base hp on the AM
-constructing a tree of life should take around 20% longer
-Increase mana of bloodlust by 5-10

3 Items in general
-Lower the coast of gem and won to 150
-Make heal potion available same time as won and gem, so that races like orc and human have a possibility to heal their weak first hero's
-Add items in the shop, like scroll of mana and boots of speed

That is it for now, if i think of some more i will add it.
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HB
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 22:22    Post subject: Reply with quote

@Lo
HoG > PI for real?
Surprised
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LoveStruck
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Location: Italy

PostPosted: Tue Aug 01, 2017 18:18    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yup, that's what I think.

Elf: Both PI and HOG strongly favour Elf. I don't think there's much of a big difference between the two maps on a high level of play, in terms of outcome. PI is probably only a bit better for the Human player, yet this race now has the cheesy militia rush at its disposal. Elf can't rush level 6 on HOG as there are too few creep camps for that and the red ones can be more easily contested as the red dragon instantly devours an archer, is able to kill the others within 4-5 hits, focuses the most wounded ones and is hard to knock down.

Undead: Both the maps have an easy level 3 creep route, yet on HOG it's easier to chase down the enemy. Also, the other races can't outcreep the Undead as much as they used to. I'd say they are slightly favoured against Orc and the match-up against Human is fairly balanced (situational on what strategies are being played).

Orc: objectively not the best map for this race. PI is more balanced against Human, even though on HOG there are good chances to find an early wand of lightning shield. It might tend in favour of the Undead as well, but this race has definitely way more chances of winning than the Undead ever had on PI.

Also to note that on HOG the shops are much more accessible and there are no imbalanced summons drops.

HB wrote:
A person working with the Classic Team has asked me to gather feedback regarding the main issues of the Reign of Chaos, so he can pass it futher.

It's a groundbreaking opportunity and we can't discourage them, so in my opinion we should focus on the absolute priorities and our suggestions should be easy to implement.

Let's post the ideas, discuss them and eventually come up with some final wishlist.

Any news on this, by the way? Has anything been sent to Kam yet?
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HB
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:09    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've sent most of the repeated ideas grouped into categories "main", "important", "additional" without the ones changing the meta a lot due to the elf outcry (like the ones nerfing creeping in a hardcore way, unfortunately). When it came to the individual ones, I chose some which were small, but needed, like the ones from Slayers_MMA regarding treants / entangle or the ones from Toxi regarding piercing/medium damage bonus or healing wards' cost. Your map-pools and creep armor/itemset changes were included as well.
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